Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Anything apart from the two mainstream default harmonicas (Solo-tuned fully-valved chromatic, and un-valved Richter 10-hole diatonic). Alternate tunings, different construction, new functionality, interesting old designs, wishful-thinking... whatever!
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IaNerd
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Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Post by IaNerd » Mon Feb 10, 2020 2:39 pm

Where have I seen this? What is it called?

Blow: D F A ... repeating
Draw: E G B ... repeating

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Re: Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Post by IaNerd » Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:10 pm

This is the best I can find so far (transposed down by two semitones). The tuning in the question above would be the following scale in spiral form with the tonics in the blow layer. But I swear I have seen this in a harmonica context.

Raga Suddha Bangala

Scale steps in semitones: 2–1–2–2–2–3

Scale degrees:
in semitones: 0–2–3–5–7–9–12
intervals: 1–2–m3–4–5–6–8
Root, Major 2nd, Minor 3rd, Perfect 4th, Perfect 5th, Major 6th, Octave

Pitches starting from C:
C D D♯ F G A c
C D E♭ F G A c

EdvinW
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Re: Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Post by EdvinW » Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:19 pm

Hmm. Not sure either.

It looks a bit like a power chromatic, three out of four holes are the same, but that might not be what you mean.
Edvin Wedin

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Re: Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Post by IaNerd » Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:48 pm

Edvin -- Yes, it's a subset of many "wider" tunings.

More on this in a moment. Stay tuned ....

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Re: Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Post by IaNerd » Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:07 pm

Consider these four different ways to achieve a minor hexatonic blues scale.

Note the similarity between Repeating Richter and Repeating Paddy.

Then note the similarity between Repeating Easy Third and Repeating Dmin Over Emin. When transposed, these bottom two tunings are identical except for the one semitone difference between their 2 and 5 blows. This difference gives Repeating Dmin Over Emin a draw-bend which is absent in its near twin.

Repeating Richter: Cmaj over Gmaj, or IV over I
Repeting Paddy: Amin over Gmaj, or ii over I
RE3: Cmaj over Dmin, or bVII over i
Repeating Dmin Over Emin: Dmin over Emin, or bvii over i

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Re: Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Post by IaNerd » Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:28 pm

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Re: Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Post by IaNerd » Sun Feb 16, 2020 4:12 pm

Over two weeks of looking and asking around have transpired, and I have tentatively concluded that as a repeating set of three holes this tuning (including its transposions) is probably new. When I get a chance, I will try to make one by re-tuning an Easttop EDharmonica as per here: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=652#p2828

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Re: Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Post by EdvinW » Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:15 pm

In your illustration of an Dm over Em harp, you have highlighted the Em blues scale. It might be worth noting that there is also a Bm blues scale, and if you overblow hole 3 there is even an Am blues scale. From your previous posts I think I've gathered that blues player like to play the same things over the I, IV and V chords (or should it be lower case numerals?) and this might be useful.

I've given some thought to what use a non-blues player might have of such a tuning. The large gap between 3D and 4B looks scary, but using the overblow you do have a complete Dm scale with a large tonic chord and several useful double stops suggesting other chords. One advantage over playing Dm on a C RE3 (which I suppose is 'C over Dm' :) ) is that you could chose between natural minor and Dorian, depending on whether you bend the B or not. The chords in an RE3 are quite useful in various kinds of traditional tunes though, so I guess it's hard to say one is better than the other.

Though you could play an F major scale as well there are few useful chords, and having the fifth as an overblow would probably be awkward. The RE3 has limitations in major keys as well, but not fully as bad.

PS. I just realised another use for this tuning: As most Europeans will be painfully aware of, the season of Eurovision Song Contest has started in many places! Minor keys are somewhat more popular than minor keys, and a key change is almost mandatory. A whole tone step is a good interval for raising the tune before the final refrain. If you can spare the seventh note of the scale after the raise, this tuning seems almost ideal for Eurovision :D
Edvin Wedin

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Re: Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Post by triona » Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:25 pm

EdvinW wrote:
Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:15 pm
... this tuning seems almost ideal for Eurovision :D

... If not most of the contestants would prefer electronical sound generation (?) :?


dear greetings
triona
Aw, Thou beloved, do hearken to the Banshee's lonely croon!
sinn féin - ça ira !
Cad é sin do'n té sin nach mbaineann sin dó


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC1yI3H ... 9ktgzTR2qg

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Re: Quick Q: What is Dm over Em?

Post by EdvinW » Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:33 pm

triona wrote:
Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:25 pm
EdvinW wrote:
Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:15 pm
... this tuning seems almost ideal for Eurovision :D

... If not most of the contestants would prefer electronical sound generation (?) :?


dear greetings
triona
Ideal for playing their songs, not necessarily ideal for the contenders ;)

Am I the only one who think using the harmonica to play tunes from very-much-non-harmonica-related genres is like the best party trick? :P
Edvin Wedin

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